Curse

October Jade · May 03, 2011, 03:37 AM // 03:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voodoo Rage

I'm actually really fascinated by the economy of this game, so if you wanted to elaborate...

The GW economy isn't really that complex. You can boil it down to only a few concepts and see how they piece together:

1) Items are static. With a few exceptions, nothing you acquire in the game will ever disappear. That means that the supply of any given weapon/mini/tonic will only grow over time.

2) A component of the demand for a particular good is the availability of similar goods (call them substitutes). You can witness this every year when the birthdays happen... the prices of old minis drop when new ones are released. The more options that exist, the less money players are willing to exchange for any one of them.

The combination of these two factors means that, ceteris paribus, prices in the goods market will continue to fall in the long run. However, it does get a little more complicated when you introduce the money market, particularly due to reason 1 above. With so few marginal costs associated with gameplay, platinum has a tendency to just accumulate which can cause inflationary pressure. This is why goldsinks are implemented: to help drain resources from the game.

The magnitudes of these opposed effects is what determines price.

thedarkmarine · May 03, 2011, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by October Jade

The GW economy isn't really that complex. You can boil it down to only a few concepts and see how they piece together:

1) Items are static. With a few exceptions, nothing you acquire in the game will ever disappear. That means that the supply of any given weapon/mini/tonic will only grow over time.

Not entirely true. Items "disappear" when materials are used for crafting, gold is lost to merchants (as you'll mention), weapons are customized, and mini's are dedicated. It slows the rate at which the quantity grows. Your overall conclusion is not affected, but I thought I'd just point this out.

spun ducky · May 03, 2011, 06:39 AM // 06:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by thedarkmarine

Not entirely true. Items "disappear" when materials are used for crafting, gold is lost to merchants (as you'll mention), weapons are customized, and mini's are dedicated. It slows the rate at which the quantity grows. Your overall conclusion is not affected, but I thought I'd just point this out.

I would assume that is why he added the few exceptions. In most high end gear people tend to not customize it out of fear of wanting to sell it eventually hence why q7 weapons and the like are still floating around most of the same from previous years.

Coast · May 03, 2011, 07:16 AM // 07:16

don't fear my man, they getting cheap alrdy(destroyer dropped with 400e alrdy as an example, could be lower by the time i typed this down alrdy!)

Mcsnake85 · May 03, 2011, 08:24 AM // 08:24

I Still dont understand why ppl complain about those things...
Really...
All you need to play the game is : weapons and armors, that can be buy for cheap, just get the weapons/armors with max stats without care about skin and you are ready to do everything.
Minipets,Tonics,Rare-Skin Weapons/Armors ARE all optional things that dont give advantage in game...Minipets dont attack mobs,Tonic forms dont give you extra points to spend on build or extra powers,Cristalline Sword with max stats gold and r9 have the same stats of a blue/purple longsword....
So please stop complain,there is no sense on do it...

Swingline · May 03, 2011, 08:26 AM // 08:26

as the days go by(and I mean just a few days) they will drop. Soon...

White = <100k

Purple = <30e

Gold = 75-100e

Green = 150-200e

and the less popular tonics will drop far below what I even said.

@ above... ppl like to look cool.

Gabs88 · May 03, 2011, 08:55 AM // 08:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feathermoore Rep

200e is nothing compared to playing the game??? What game are you playing? Numerous people have played through the entire game HM and NM and haven't amassed nearly as much as that.

Quit trolling. Use moar facts.

Now if you had said that the tonics were given at random just like the previous gifts, and that the random odds of obtaining one that was worth 200e was still left up to chance, I'd give you more credit. However the price base for these tonics are nowhere near the value of the original oldest year/rarest minipets. But all of this can be attributed to new rares being introduced to the game, where the only way to obtain more is to wait for other characters to age and then randomly generate more. The prices of these will go down as market supply increase, but they still will be excessively expensive. Why? beacuse there is simply nothing left to buy in the game to people who have amased x000s of ectos.

200e is a very easy amount to amass.

AFK Vanquishing Services, pretty much any zone in EOTN will earn you 8e + your drops @ 125 per kill, very easy to find clients in EOTN or Tyria.
Mission runs 10-12e \ hour
Dungeon runs - 8-30e \ hour depending on how good you are and what dungeons you run.
AFK Glints Challenge - 1e every 20 minutes AFKing.
Farming Vaettirs or Raptors in holiday weekends, 10e per hour.
FoWSC or UWSC 8e \ hour easy, chance of drops worth much more
UW or FoW farming 8-12e \ hour
SoOSC - Random drops but can be extremely profitable
Dedicated GVG or HA play, 500-1000e per month
Running EOTN tours, 5 or 6k per person. 2 runs an hour in the weekends, 70-80k \ hour.
Feather Farming not in holiday weekends, 20-30k \ hour. In Holiday weekends 40-50k \ hour.
Powertrading - Almost unlimited amounts

All this said, it has gotten significantly harder to get rich just playing the game normally. But in return farming is more profitable then ever

majoho · May 03, 2011, 09:07 AM // 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verene

You know that Anet doesn't set the price for these things and that the players do, right? It's not like they can say "You cannot sell this item for more than 100k" or anything like that.

They'll drop in price - they already are dropping from what they were at Thursday night.

I think his point is more why are they tradeable at all.

Gabs88 · May 03, 2011, 09:27 AM // 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by majoho

I think his point is more why are they tradeable at all.

Cause it would be RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing boring if you couldn't trade them? Imagine someone getting Everlasting Kuunavang or Destroyer and not even liking the damn tonic \ minipet.

Most players with a brain can figure out a way to make very good money in this game.

Bright Star Shine · May 03, 2011, 12:15 PM // 12:15

To be honest, why is this a problem? I want to tank DoA as a Margonite, just for lulz, because I think it's funny to see ~30 margonites trying to bash another Margonite's head in. Just to really screw with things. The fact that I am not playing for 6 years should not be a restriction to this. Since the way you look is purely cosmetic, and it doesn't add anything to your gameplay except for some laughs you can have, why should then only 6th year people get it?

Also, if they couldn't be traded, and someone got an El Dunkoro, but he really wanted that El Miku, it would be totally unfair towards this person that he could not acquire his Miku tonic and would be stuck with a lame ass Dunkoro.

So, they should be tradeble, and unless they were all the same tonic, they should not be not tradeble (if that makes sense).

Lest121 · May 03, 2011, 12:54 PM // 12:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by shinta_himura

Some of the new 6th Year tonics are 200+ ectos... What I'm wondering is, why are these tonics even tradeable? They're a 6th Year Anniversary gift to old players, but there are people who come in to the game, play for maybe 6 months, abuse the economy to become insanely rich and buy whatever they want.

The point of a video game is to play it. I'm sick of Arena Net catering to the rich. Almost every high-end or extraordinary item that has come into the game since EOTN is just a bonus for speed clearers or rich people.

The current system won't change, but I am praying they customize birthday gifts and gift giveaways in GW2, I was gonna make this thread few weeks ago, it's RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOed up when some random dude goes to a convention wins a prize and turns it into profit, while you can't even attend the same convention because it's half way around the world..

Dzjudz · May 03, 2011, 01:49 PM // 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lest121

The current system won't change, but I am praying they customize birthday gifts and gift giveaways in GW2, I was gonna make this thread few weeks ago, it's RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOed up when some random dude goes to a convention wins a prize and turns it into profit, while you can't even attend the same convention because it's half way around the world..

Then you get the argument mentioned by Lasai in post #10, that people will complain that they can never get it because they can't even attend the same convention because it's half way around the world, so in that sense it being tradable would actually make it more accessible to people.

bhavv · May 03, 2011, 02:43 PM // 14:43

In GW2, I think that should be given an exclusive bound to account mini dhuum that also targets the nearest player character and dhuum slices them, causing a disconnect. Being a mini version, ofc its smaller banhammer wouldnt work very effectrively, and it wont do anymore than run around DCing people.

It should be completely untradable, and no one else should be allowed to get one, surely this makes complete sense in the spirit of the OP.

Bright Star Shine · May 03, 2011, 02:56 PM // 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabs88

FoWSC or UWSC 8e \ hour easy, chance of drops worth much more
UW or FoW farming 8-12e \ hour

I'd like to see you get 8-12e farming in UW for an hour.

Also, UWSC unless performed by experience guilds is very hard to yield you 8e/hour..

Best way is still DoASC imo.

40min runs, 80k/run, 1 run/day will yield you ~300-350e/month. That's only doing 1 run/day, in a dedicated DoASC guild you can get 3-4 runs/day easily if you have the time for it.

bhavv · May 03, 2011, 03:02 PM // 15:02

I really doubt that Gab's ecto rates are anywhere near accurate, but yes, shadow form did kill PVE farming.

If you are really bothered about the virtual economy in GW, then you should try focusing your efforts more towards the joke that is shadow form.

Painbringer · May 03, 2011, 03:06 PM // 15:06

It shows how stupidly over infalted everything is after the shadow nightmare expliot Anet blinded eye ecto farm.

thedarkmarine · May 03, 2011, 03:43 PM // 15:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Painbringer

It shows how stupidly over infalted everything is after the shadow nightmare expliot Anet blinded eye ecto farm.

Supply and...

you know what, i'm not even going to try any more.

You're right. I fully agree with you!

RedStar · May 03, 2011, 03:47 PM // 15:47

Eternal Tonics are almost completely useless :
-you can't show off your character
-they can't be put in the HoM (the main reason for the sudden increase in minipets price)

Their price will more than quickly fall.

(And before someone goes "omg how dare you say they are useless, QQ moar, never happy, it's free stuff" : I didn't mean "useless" in a bad way but, well, they are almost useless. You use them to see a character for you own pleasure, they don't do anything else).

Voodoo Rage · May 03, 2011, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by October Jade

1) Items are static. With a few exceptions, nothing you acquire in the game will ever disappear. That means that the supply of any given weapon/mini/tonic will only grow over time.

Keep in mind that a lot of players are leaving the game, so over time there are more abandoned accounts (and permanently banned accounts too). So definitely items obtained in the past (like a mini-Kuunavang) are going to decrease in supply over time.

Tyrole · May 03, 2011, 04:50 PM // 16:50

I suspect 6th year tonics will drop in price quite consistently. Unlike minipets (which I actually expect to stay stable in price - or possibly rise - as GW2 approaches), the ELs can't be dedicated. The dedication aspect, along with the calculator to make it easy, adds instant value to an item because it, in a very slight sense, let's you "take it with you" to GW2.

And as someone who has been playing since the very beginning but doesn't like farming and has periods of inactivity, I can say it's nice to be able to sell my ELs to filthy rich collectors immediately when they come out and be able to now afford my 30/50 for GW2. If you're not filthy rich, then you should just be patient - ELs have nothing beyond cosmetic value.